Talk:Medieval 2010

Statistics
Please add your information (and update it) about how you're doing on this year's job search. Information included is ABD/PhD/Current position type (Area): # of applications | # of requests for more materials | # of rejections | # of initial interviews (MLA or phone; you can specify which type if you'd like) | # of campus visits | # of offers

PhD TT


 * PhD TT (Old English): 6 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 1 rejection | 2 interview requests | 2 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan. 19)

Can I please have your current TT job if you go to Oregon or Wisconsin? --Sure thing. Especially because you said "please." Actually, I hate to tell you, but neither school is interested in me. This is how competitive the job market is. Nor I! I wonder who the heck Oregon and Wisc are interviewing then, if not us. Their MLA counts seem low.


 * PhD TT (Middle English): 17 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 6 rejections | 1 search canceled (not medieval) | 3 interview requests | 1 campus visit | 0 offers (updated Jan. 20)


 * PhD TT (Old English): 5 applications | 1 rejection | 4 interview requests | withdrew from consideration for personal reasons

PhD non-TT


 * PhD non-TT (Middle English): 23 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 10 rejections (2 after requests for more materials) | 2 jobs canceled (not medieval) | 0 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan. 20)


 * PhD non-TT (Middle English): 16 applications | 8 requests for more materials (1 generalist) | 3 rejections | 5 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec. 18)


 * PhD non-TT (Late Medieval and Renaissance): 30-ish? applications (across both fields) | 3 requests for more materials | lots of rejections (1 after request or more materials)| 4 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan 18)


 * PhD non-TT (Late Medieval/Middle English): 18 or so applications | 6 requests for more materials | 2 rejections | 6 interview requests | 4 campus visits | 0 offers


 * PhD non-TT (Comparative Late Medieval and Renaissance): 25 or so applications (across both fields) | 6 requests for more materials | haven't counted rejections | 0 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec 18)


 * PhD non-TT (Old English/Middle English): 18 applications | 7 requests for more materials | 7 rejections | 4 interview requests | 2 campus visit | 0 offers (updated Jan. 21)
 * PhD non-TT (MedRen): around 25 apps across both fields | 5 requests for more materials | many rejections | 1 MLA interview | 1 campus interview (updated Jan 21)

ABD


 * ABD (Old English): 4 applications | 0 requests for more materials | 1 rejection | 0 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec. 4)


 * ABD (Old English): 22 applications | 6 requests for more materials | 7 rejections | 3 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan.18)


 * ABD (Middle English): 13 applications | 3 requests for more materials | 4 rejections | 0 interview requests | 0 Campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec. 10)


 * ABD (Middle English): 7 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 5 rejections (1 after conference interview) | 1 interview request | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan. 20)


 * ABD (Middle English): 16 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 2 rejections | 0 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec. 2)


 * ABD (Middle English): 8 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 2 rejections | 5 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec. 14)

Damn, that's a good percentage. What kind of institution you graduating from? JW

Yes, I feel lucky; graduating from an Ivy.

Pretty sure the Ivy part doesn't explain it; you must just be awesome.


 * ABD (Middle English): 14 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 6 rejections | 0 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan. 7)


 * ABD (Middle English): 10 applications | 3 requests for more materials | 3 rejections | 2 interview requests | 1 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan. 6)


 * ABD (Middle English): 17 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 5 rejections | 0 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Jan. 12)


 * ABD (Comparative): 9 applications | 2 requests for more materials | 2 rejections | 0 interview request | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec. 10)


 * ABD (Middle English): 11 applications | 4 requests for more materials | 3 rejections | 3 interview requests | 0 campus visits | 0 offers (updated Dec. 18)
 * ABD (Middle English): 2 applications | 1 request for more materials | 1 rejection | 1 interview request | 1 campus visit | 0 offers (updated Jan. 15)

Gender and Hiring Practices in Medieval Studies

What chances do males have in landing a job in medieval studies?

I don't know how long your question has been here (it's in an inconspicuous spot), but I have wondered this myself at times. In the few years that I've been on the market as a medievalist, I've noticed most of the women I know have a much easier time landing TT jobs than the men. How much of this is due to institutional hiring practices (making up for, apparently, hiring too many men in the past), and how much is due to other factors (more women than men do the kinds of things medieval hiring committees tend to prize most--Chaucer, ME, women's studies, Arthur, etc.) I'm not sure. I'd love to hear other people on this. I can imagine it's frustrating to be a man on the market and always finding out a woman got the job. (P.S. In no way do I mean to imply the men or women are more or less qualified.)

- Couldn't it just be a numbers thing? Aren't there simply more women in grad school in the humanities over all, and more women in English literature in particular?

- I think this is a perception thing. I'm a few years out, and all of my male medievalist friends are employed. In fact, I can think of several jobs that I lost to male candidates in the past few years, and those were just the ones I bothered to look into.

Comments on This Year's Job Search
(See below for a lively discourse on Breaking Wind and Winding up with a Job==

What a great year, all things considered!

I'm predicting that since there are so few medieval jobs this year, most will be won by people already in TT jobs looking for better ones. ABDs will have the least chance, but PhDs a year or two in without TT jobs currently (unless they have multiple good pubs) will also come up short. But maybe I'm just pessimistic?
 * Just want to disagree about there being so few medieval jobs. There are many more this year than in the last couple of years as far as I can tell.
 * Last year there were 35 jobs (according to the wiki) but 7 were canceled. This year there are 21 jobs (I didn't count the medieval rhetoric or the Mediterranean ones), some of which may come to be canceled (although I hope not).
 * I stand corrected. I think more of the jobs seem like good ones than last year's batch, but that's subjective, of course. In any event, best of luck to us all.
 * I personally was more excited about more of last year's jobs than I am about this year's batch, but as you say, it's definitely subjective.
 * All went well at one interview went at the end, as I was standing up to shake hands when I broke wind: the committee fled the room but assured me that these things happen. I hope I get a campus visit. HAs this ever happened to anyone? How does one apologize in the such a case?

Are you serious? This actually happened to you? They assured you that these things happen while fleeing the room? I have heard that such bizarre things do happen but can well imagine the shock and (not to mention) the shame...I wonder what Swift or Derrida or Chaucer's eagle would have to say to all this striking of the air...
 * Has anyone something so bizarre to report to enliven the current state of affairs?
 * Many years ago an inebrieted search chair at the interview fell asleep and during an interview and woke up asking about Antonin Artaud's conception of air...

-- Some years ago a friend of mine was on a campus visit and immediately after the hectic 4-course lunch with the Dean, he couldn't but let loose a obstreperous fart - the dean was mighty amused and remarked 'so you have reached just the kind of comfort level none of your competitors have attained' - needless to say he got the job! Don't mean to be the downer in response to such a great story, but I do wonder what the result would have been if the farter had been a woman.

-- In one instance in a Research 1 university a certain older professor on the committee (of 7) was interviewing a candidate when he let fly a fart 'as greet as it had been a thonder-dent / that with the strook [the entire committee] was almoost yblent,' at which point the interviewee remarked that in Chaucer's day such an event would not be socially inappropriate and, having cited the lines I have typed out, went on to invoke 'hendy nicholas'. The professor, not in the least amused, asked with growing irritation: "so you think I am like Nicholas?" The interviewee, realizing that he had made a fatal mistake, tried changing the topic by generalizing and likening the breaking of any air to speaking and cited the "eagle" auctoritee from the Hous of Fame: "soun is nought but eyr ybroken /and evry speche that ys yspoken / lod or pryvee foul or fair / In ys substance is but eyr." Another committee member asked politely if Chaucer collapsed the distinction between sounds that were verbally meaningful (speche) and all kinds of "noyse or soun" (evidently alluding to the non-verbal noyse emitted a few moments ago). The interviewer seized the occasion to talk about Thomas Erfurt, Petrus Hellias and the other grammarians writing on sound. And then, all taking a breath of fresh air, commenced to talk about speculative grammar and their conception of speche...the interviewee ended up finally getting the job for, as someone on the committee put it, "dextrously handling a noisome event to advantage." A lesson to be learnt!

--are farts gendered? -Our reaction to them might be. Yes, one need only think of Joyce and the erotic sentiments en-gendered by Nora's farts. -I love this thread. It makes me so proud and happy to be a medievalist! - I agree, if nothing else we are filled with flatulence! - I once heard the tale of a job interview with a certain R1 school, wherein one member of the committee, a very famous, well-respected scholar (who was not a medievalist, btw), got up and excused himself to the bathroom in the middle of the interview, whereupon he proceeded to have explosive diarrhea. Unfortunately, the interview was in a rather small hotel room, and the bathroom was next to the room where the interview was being held, so the interviewers and interviewee had to shout over the sounds emanating from the bathroom for the rest of the interview. Very, very distracting and embarassing for all involved! - Did the candidate get the job?

Questions/Comments about the Wiki
A position for a Professor of Rhetoric just went up at Arizona State. They specifically ask for a person in the History of Rhetoric that does Classical/Medieval Rhetoric...I'm going to post it on the main page unless someone objects.

Is there any interest in including a category for requests for more information, or are we tacitly agreeing that's tmi this year?
 * I think that would be a good thing to add. More info is better!
 * Absolutely! I'm the one who set up the page and completely forgot to include a line for requests for more info. It's an important part of the process, so I'd definitely like to see it.

I saw this posting today (link). Should we put it up on the page or is it too general?
 * I would think it would fit more in the British Open wiki page.

Hi Folks--In the spirit of cyber community, can we all please add new jobs to the list when we see them? I've seen jobs on here that I completely missed elsewhere. I for one would be most grateful for this! Thanks and good luck to all! [moved from main page to discussion page]
 * Well, since new jobs have been updated on these pages, I think that people are indeed doing that. However, all of the jobs listed have been posted on either the MLA Job Information List, the Chronicle of Higher Education, or HigherEdJobs. If you haven't at least been checking those three sites frequently, you really should be.

It seems that many of us are interested in whether the requests for additional information are by email or snail mail. (I figured they'd all be via email, but then Albion sent their requests via post.) Can we be as specific as possible when we add information to the 'additional materials' column!?

I just looked at the Renaissance Wiki and they've put up a neat chart for tracking interviews. Anyone object to doing the same thing here?
 * I think it's fine (we had something similar last year) but I'd rather see it on this page, so I'm going to take the lead and add a section to this page. I'll format it like we did here last year since that includes more information than what the Ren page is doing.
 * Awesome -- it looks great!

Hey all - this posting just came up for British and History of English Language. Although it's not specifically medieval, I figure many of us have the expertise in HEL so I wanted to bring it to people's attention.

And here's another posting that we might want to move to the main page -- a Mellon post-doc in medieval studies at Notre Dame.

Is anyone interested in having "Campus Visits Scheduled" and "Offers Made" sections at the top of the wiki as they do on the 18c and 19c pages? *I'd love to see this. I'm tired of scrolling down!

- Great! Does someone with better skills than me want to try setting one up? (Sorry to pass the buck, but I'm sure I'd mess it up). - The reason I don't like having these sections is that often people just update that section and don't update individual school sections. I really would like to make sure that both areas get updated if we add these sections to the top.

Questions about Specific Schools
Anyone heard anything from Loyola Marymount? I'm surprised they haven't sent out calls for dossiers yet.
 * The two-year VAP? Quite a few people have received requests for more materials (dossiers) already.
 * Apologies, I meant to say Marymount!

Early Medieval vs. Late Medieval
I'm curious if anyone wants to share any thoughts about whether you think your chances are netter or worse based on if you study Old English or Middle English. When not specified otherwise, I always assume a school will take a later person (to teach Chaucer, maybe Arthur, maybe women's medieval literature). Agree or disagree? Any other relevant thoughts? I just wish ads would specify so we don't waste our time applying one way or the other.

My anecdotally-informed (as in, thoroughly unsupported by research or data beyond experience) impression is that if the announcement does not specify, then usually Middle English people have better chances because they are perceived as having more relevance to the wider field of English studies and a broader range of teaching capabilities. This year there are a couple of prominent schools looking for an Old English specialist, but this is not often the case. If you do Old English and are applying anywhere other than to an R1 school specifying an OE person, I suggest not advertising your expertise in a single class of strong-verb inflection in some dialects of (possibly) Mercian that are represented in a set of manuscripts thought to derive from Hand A of Bunglebrook Abbey. Hypothetically. Or maybe Exeter.

Statistics about how many job seekers are posting to this wiki
'''In the interests of further data collection about the current state of the job market (and also to determine what percentage of job seekers are using this wiki), I have an idea. What if we list all of the jobs here so that wiki-users can indicate which ones they've applied to; this way we can get a count of how many applications there were per school from wiki-users. Then, if anyone hears any definitive information regarding the total number of applications that a particular school received (in a rejection letter, search update, etc.), we can post that number so as to get a better sense of the percentages. Does this make sense?'''

Albion College (# of wiki-user applicants: 10 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Alfred University (# of wiki-user applicants: 3 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Amherst College (# of wiki-user applicants: 17 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: 150+)

Arizona State University (# of wiki-user applicants: 0 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Bard College (# of wiki-user applicants: 14 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Bemidji State University (# of wiki-user applicants: 4 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Indiana University Northwest (# of wiki-user applicants: 3 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Kent State University (# of wiki-user applicants: 7 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Loyola College (# of wiki-user applicants: 9 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Marymount University (# of wiki-user applicants: 9 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

McGill University (# of wiki-user applicants: 7 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Miami University (# of wiki-user applicants: 6 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Middle Tennessee State University (# of wiki-user applicants: 9 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Mount St. Mary's University (# of wiki-user applicants: 6 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

New York University, Gallatin School (# of wiki-user applicants: 10 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: 200+)

Reed College (# of wiki-user applicants: 15 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Southern Connecticut State University (# of wiki-user applicants: 2 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

University of Arkansas (# of wiki-user applicants: 8 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: 200+)

University of California, LA (# of wiki-user applicants: 0 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

University of Hartford (# of wiki-user applicants: 11 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

University of Michigan (# of wiki-user applicants: 11 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

University of Oregon (# of wiki-user applicants: 8 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

University of Pittsburgh (# of wiki-user applicants: 13 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

University of Texas-Pan American (# of wiki-user applicants: 8 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Victoria University of Wellington (# of wiki-user applicants: 5 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

University of Wisconsin-Madison (# of wiki-user applicants: 6 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Westmont College (# of wiki-user applicants: 2 - total # of applications known to have been submitted: ?)

Keeping Track
This is what, the third year of the Wiki? I wonder if anyone else besides me might be interested in compiling a comparative list of jobs and job ads compared to recipients of the jobs and their CVs at time of hire. That might provide useful information. I've read the MLA's interview results, but the MLA depends on Search Committee responses: that is to say, what the committee members who responded say in a survey may or may not be related to what the committee actually does. I'm interested in the actual process and what that might tell us.
 * I think the stress of the job market is really starting to get to people. This is way too much analysis and would take too much time. Focus on getting more research done (and articles published), especially if you have a dissertation to finish. Getting from ABD to PhD and getting publications (and teaching experience) will benefit you a LOT more in the job search than trying to find the "magic combination" that successful applicants have. (Which is probably publications, teaching experience, and fit into the department's need.)

It might also be interesting if people are willing to share their successful application letters-with names blacked out or removed-so that those not getting interviews can see what a real successful letter looks like.
 * There are lots of places online where you can find samples of application letters. You could also ask around at your PhD-granting institution if previous graduates made examples available. (Heck, if you don't already have a program that does that at your university, then maybe you could start one and get files of sample letters from students at your university.) I, for one, would not be comfortable with sharing my letter, even with names blacked out, on this wiki. (Besides, even with names blacked out, we'd be easily identifiable based upon our discussion of our research.)

Many people aren't on the wiki, of course, but I do notice a huge disparity between number of interview requests got by people here and the total number of interviews there must be (say, 20 places x several candidates). But I agree the above idea would require too much anatomization. And I think people here, as honest as they are, still keep a lot to themselves--not sure why, but I believe so.

I think it is appropriate that they do so (keep some to themselves). For the most part, I think the decorum and the amount of information, restricted to what is of any real, immediate use in terms of the searches currently running, is nearly optimal. For instance, one post goes over the line in my opinion on the Amherst section, listing the "distinguished" committee members by name. No one but those with interviews needs that information, and it is provided to candidates when they ask at the time of their interview invitation. That is an instance of unseemly tmi, imho. I do not want to see the site, for which I am so grateful, devolve into a paranoid info-crunching machine. I'd also say that I am really impressed by my colleagues' generosity and candor on this site.
 * I completely agree. And I'm going to take it upon myself to remove the info from the Amherst section. If the majority object to the removal, then it can be added back. But I really think that is information that only the people with interviews need to know. (By the way, we should always remember that this is a public forum, and search committees might be lurking. I think we've been professional for the most part but we definitely want to keep it that way.)-excellent. I support this move.

Just want to say good luck to all those heading to MLA next weekend. It's great to be part of such a collegial wiki. (x3) I agree that there must be transparency but without names - in any case I hope those with MLA interviews hear back soon! Has any heard so far?

MLA INTERVIEW SUCCESS
by the way,I have just learnt from a medievalist ABD that all ABDS without ivy-league exp. need not despair and can nurture hope if they have a clear and strong teaching pedagogy and 3-4 YEARS MEDIEVAL teaching experience at the undergraduate level and 3-4 peer-reviewed publications, and half a dozen conference presentations in national and international conferences and skills across disciplines and languages.

SHOULD THOSE WHO HAVE TAUGHT ONLY COMPOSITION SHOULD GIVE UP HOPE RIGHT AWAY?

This seems very depressing - in my University (reputed for medieval studies), I have taught only comp. but I had MLA interviews. I hope what you say is not necessarily true. What do the rest think?

Would the kind of person described above have a relatively good chance of landing a job? Of course. Would that be the only kind of candidate to land a job? Absolutely not. One can't predict what institutions want or need, especially non-big-deal places.

It also pays to remember that ABDs in any field and any year always have a tough time, precisely because they are ABD. That's hardly cause for despair; finish the diss and get working on your CV. You can then move into a different "class" of applicants in SC eyes. And unlike Ivy-status or some other factors, getting from ABD to PhD is something you control. Despairing because you're ABD and can't land a job doesn't make a lot of sense; the system isn't really designed to hire ABDs, although of course it does happen and people should apply for any job they feel they could get.

- Good point but I just wondered what kind of publication record would be expected from someone with a fresh PHD? Don't Phds have to work harder than ABDs to acquire 3-4 peer-reviewed journal articles? By the way, does anyone know typically how many ABDs have how many publications in peer-reviewed journals? Thanks

- You're right that expectations increase as you move from ABD to new PhD (and so on). From what I've observed, the ideal candidate is usually a new PhD (say, defended within the last 12 months) with at least one article. They are usually still seen as shiny and new (and relatively cheap) but have some track record. That's why I think it pays not to be too despairing if you're ABD and aren't getting much of a response; you're about to move into a much more marketable category, although I think you'd need at least one good article by then (either out or forthcoming). This is not to dismiss the disappointment of missing out on a job as an ABD, which happened to me three times and was always heart-breaking. But with hindsight I can see that it was always a long-shot; I feel like I have a much better chance now. As far as number of pubs for ABDs goes, any publication will look pretty good to a SC but the problem is not just track record but getting the dissertation finished. Friends in TT jobs say that the reason departments don't hire ABDs is not that they don't see the potential, but that they don't want to be stuck with someone who is still trying to finish three years later. - very sound advice but as an ABD I may add that I just received a campus-interview at a very good college and what struck the committe at the interview were, as they put it, my publications in peer-reviewed journals (four) and three research projects...I will get back if I get the job. - Absolutely; that's a fantastic record by anyone's standards and there's no question a SC would be interested in that kind of output, especially as it's so rare for an ABD to have achieved that much. I guess my comments are more aimed at anyone who (like me) went on the market ABD with one good publication and found/is finding that it's hard to get noticed. Good luck with the search and let us know when you hear - it's so great to hear some success stories! Thanks - but I just wanted to add that English medievalist ABDs should consider reading across periods (early modern) and across langauges -(and nothing like a publication that spans medieval and early modern periods or two langauges)- that is one way showing that you have more to offer than many others...hope this helps.

- I guess hardwork pays off at the end more than anything else!